Political Civil War
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« on: March 30, 2017, 12:56:04 pm »

Throughout history, by far the most brutal wars have been civil wars (within one's own country).   In fact, almost all assassinations have been perpetrated by citizens of the victim's own country. 
Right now, we have a virtual political civil war going on.  Trump's adversaries are happy to undermine and cripple the USA just so they can attack Trump.  It's sort of the opposite of wedding vows where one is supposed to be loyal for better or worse, etc.  The attitude of Trump's foes is "screw the country, let's resist and attack Trump". 
Also, Trump is not a conservative, and really not even a republican.  The conservatives and some republicans have been bitterly complaining that Trump is not conservative enough for the past 2 years. 

Imagine if the president was as conservative as Obama was liberal.  THAT would shake things up. 
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« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2017, 03:08:16 pm »

 I love how you throw out this talk of civil war. Clearly, the biggest civil war right now is WITHIN the Republican party itself.

Given that they are in control of ALL 3 branches of government, and Trump "The Closer" who promised to repeal and replace Obamacare as one of his big moves when in office, FAILED because of conflict and infighting within the party- it's clear where the civil war is happening. You want to know who his adversaries are who are undermining him- it's his own hubris, and his fellow Republicans.

Oh- and I think the correct statement is: screw party loyalty- our first duty is to our country, not to some egotistic narcissist who doesn't know how to pass legislation despite claiming to be an expert negotiator. Your loyalty, for better or worse, should be to your country and not to your party or president.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2017, 03:22:19 pm by (Hidden) » Logged
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Tell someone you love them today, because life is short.
But shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
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« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2017, 07:45:50 pm »

I love how you throw out this talk of civil war. Clearly, the biggest civil war right now is WITHIN the Republican party itself.

Given that they are in control of ALL 3 branches of government, and Trump "The Closer" who promised to repeal and replace Obamacare as one of his big moves when in office, FAILED because of conflict and infighting within the party- it's clear where the civil war is happening. You want to know who his adversaries are who are undermining him- it's his own hubris, and his fellow Republicans.

Oh- and I think the correct statement is: screw party loyalty- our first duty is to our country, not to some egotistic narcissist who doesn't know how to pass legislation despite claiming to be an expert negotiator. Your loyalty, for better or worse, should be to your country and not to your party or president.

Once again, you are wrong.
While there are divisions in the republican party, it is the democrats who are flagrantly abusing party loyalty.  Not one of them supported any changes to Osamacare.  That is sad, because Obamacare is failing, and is doomed to end in about a year.  It's already extremely expensive, and offers very little in the way of healthcare.   Trump's idea is to reduce healthcare costs to make insurance affordable.. and allow people to purchase it if they want it.  Obama's idea was to let the costs spin out of control, and FORCE everybody to purchase healthcare - and if they didn't suffer severe financial penalties.   A healthy non-smoker in their 20's working for minimum wage might not want to pay for healthcare.. which subsidizes the healthcare of someone who has existing medical needs.   

Trump will get his affordable care act passed, it will just take a bit longer than anticipated.  He will have his plan in place in a shorter amount of time than it took Obama to ram Obamacare through Congress in a one-party vote. 
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« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2017, 08:05:12 pm »

yeah i won't hold my breath on an egotistical Oompa-Loompa who bankrupt his company 4-5 times.
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« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2017, 08:05:36 pm »

You're the one who should check your facts-

Obamacare was NOT rammed by one party vote- it was carefully crafted over a long period to get a consensus from other parties and groups. The bill that was attempted to be rammed by one party vote and FAILED was Trumpcare.

Trumpcare failed because it had a measly 17% approval rating, was so terribly conceived that all health care providers and medical professionals were AGAINST it, and famously- it would result in MILLIONS of people becoming uninsured.

The DEFINITION of insurance is that costs ARE distributed- the healthy help pay for the sick. That's the way it works. If only sick people got insured, the insurance companies would go bankrupt. Read more than just talking points from Trumpcare boosters. (What few there are!  laugh laugh )

Democrats were united because Trumpcare was SO BAD no one wanted it- (see 17% approval) and that's why it was easy to maintain party loyalty- while the divided Republicans couldn't be convinced by Trump to vote for his bill despite all the anti-Obamacare promises and rhetoric. Talk is cheap- they proved they couldn't do it when it came time to act.

You seem to think that ramming legislation in a short time span is a good thing... Trumpcare, unlike the affordable care act, was so rushed, it failed to pass and get support from a unified Republican party. It wasn't given enough time to develop properly. It's the sort of shoddy planning that this admin is getting to be known for. That's why they keep losing. Trump will NOT have a plan in place- stop deluding yourself. Even Speaker Ryan admitted that Obamacare is the law of the land, he knows and admits they failed big time. It's so much fun to punch holes in all your arguments.   Grin

Here- read something other than Alt-facts: https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexislevinson/after-that-health-care-fail-its-not-clear-if-republicans?utm_term=.dsNA6XyM7#.weV2N7yMe


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Tell someone you love them today, because life is short.
But shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
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« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2017, 10:16:04 pm »

Stop talking facts brianboru72!  You're destroying the thread starter with truth and exposing him as an idiot fanatic!
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« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2017, 10:23:20 pm »

American politics are so polarized; So, I understand why people avoid discussing politics.
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« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2017, 07:58:44 pm »

Trump's adversaries are happy to undermine and cripple the USA just so they can attack Trump
lmao what? where?

Quote
Imagine if the president was as conservative as Obama was liberal.  THAT would shake things up.

Except for the fact that Obama was objectively, mathematically, demonstrably, one of the most moderate presidents we've ever had.
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